Interview with Shyne’s Mom XXL Magazine June 2004

In the aftermath of the trial, you were quoted in a couple of newspaper articles. You seemed very upset with the things the main-stream media was writing about your son.

They were saying that he was a gun-toting brother. They were saying he was reckless,  which he was not. He just made one mistake. I don’t see why during the trial they really bashed him. The reckless endangerment, the hurting of other people—they don’t have proof of that. There was another gun in the club too, a .40 caliber there. Linked to nobody. It wasn’t even a trial about him. It was all about the other guy. I always wondered why.

Do you think your son got a fair trial?

I don’t think it was a fair trial because of the lawyers. The lawyers didn’t do their job for him. My son’s lawyers were working more for the other guy. Ian Niles was a friend of Puffy. That’s the way Jamal got to know him. If the other guy’s paying for your defense, most naturally the other guy can call the shots and say, “I want you to do this” and “I want you to do that.” It’s a conflict of interest right there. Ian and Murray Richman didn’t care about working for Shyne. Puffy was telling them what to do, what not to do.

Were you in the courtroom during the trial?

I went there for three people. I didn’t go there to just support my son. I went to support, God bless him, Wolf, Puffy and Jamal. I went there not knowing anybody, this was the first time I ever went into a courtroom. The first day we was sitting on the other side [the prosecu¬tion's side], ’cause I didn’t know there was gonna be any place for me to be. When we had a break me and my mom went downstairs and, later, we were coming up in the elevator with Puff. He looks at me and said, “You look familiar.” And I said, “Yes, I’m Shyne’s mother.” He said, “Oh, you’re Shyne’s mother. I knew you looked familiar.” And then he said, “Well, I want you to come and sit on the other side [the defense's side] with us.” So I said, “OK.”
Days after that, when me and my mom came, there was no space for us, no seats for us. Already the people for Puff were there, seated—they weren’t thinking about Shyne’s mother or his grandmother. A lot of people came in support of Puff. So this tall guy, the guard, one day he had to say to them, “There has to be a row of seats for Shyne’s mom and his family.” And that’s the way we tried to squeeze ourselves in. And from there I looked at them and thought, they don’t care anything about us—it’s all about the other guy.

What was your opinion of the way the trial was going?

It was looking bad—not for Shyne but for Puff. Puffy’s driver went on the stand talking about the gun, and that was really looking bad for Puff. And I felt very bad too. And then Cherise Myers came on the stand and I could not believe it! Puff came up to me to apolo¬gize. And I was so shocked, I couldn’t say anything to him.

He apologized to you after Cherise Myers testified?

Yes, he said “I’m sorry.” Puff came to me and said, “I’m sorry.”

Her testimony was damaging to Shyne?

She totally changed her story. When we was going down in the elevator with the lawyers, I said to Murray, “How did you let this happen? You didn’t know Cherise was going to talk against my son?” He said, “You have to ask Puff that.” That’s what opened my eyes. If you are representing my child, how could you let something like this happen? But then again, it’s about who calls the shots.
I always thought there was gonna be a unity between them, that they were going to work something out. But he wasn’t looking out for nobody else but Puff.

Do you think they always had that intention? Or did something happen in the trial that made them go into panic mode?

I think he always had that intention, because we never knew what was going on until that day I walked into the courtroom and I heard this and I heard that. I don’t think he had a way of letting my son get off. Another thing I was totally upset with was that the jury didn’t even bring Puff in guilty of gun possession. Nothing!
Every day I get… Not every day now, because I’ve accepted it—but still not fully… But, God did it for a reason. Because if Jamal had gotten off, if he was free, maybe he would have to go back with the other guy. He betrayed my son totally. I don’t know who in the whole world doesn’t see that.

But I read in the Village Voice that after the verdicts were delivered, Puff, his mother and Johnnie Cochran came over to you and said something to the effect of, “We’re going to appeal this, we’re gonna do what¬ever we can.”

I wasn’t even there. I was not hearing anything. I was in total shock. I didn’t even shed a tear then. I couldn’t even cry. I cannot remember what Puffy said. I was out for a few seconds. I did not think that was going to happen. I didn’t like the defense. ‘Cause all along they were saying Jamal didn’t have a gun, he wasn’t guilty. And then all of a sudden they have a plan. You understand? I didn’t like when I heard my son was gonna acknowledge guilt in any way. They threw the bag in his lap, let him be the fall guy. They think he had nothing to lose.

Has Puffy given you any financial support?

I want to set the record straight. Because it took him a year, and I write down everything. This [pulls out address book and points to the date] is when he called me because he wanted to give me money: January 3, 2002. He called and said, “Mrs…. Mrs. Barrow?” So I said, “Who is this? Because I’m not Mrs. Barrow.” It was Puffy. And he went on and immedi¬ately I did not entertain him, because I knew that Jamal would be very upset.
It took him a year to call me since my son had been convicted. And I said, “Yes, what is the problem?” And he said, “I have something for you.” So I said, “I cannot talk to you, because my son is going to call me right now and I cannot talk to you.” Immediately after, one of his guys called me and told me he had some¬thing for me. I said, “$3,500 from who?” And he said, “$3,500from Puff.” So I said, “Well, you better keep that.” [He said] “You gotta be kid¬ding.” [I said] “No! No! No!” I just hope that guy took that money back, ’cause I want Puffy to know I didn’t take it. Because he’s always say¬ing that he’s taking care of my son. No way. He doesn’t know the pain I go through every day. Every day for the last three years. My only child. The world is not easy. Not easy at all.
Listen to me: that was a slap to me and my son’s face—very disrespectful. And I want you to tell everybody that, and that’s coming from me

So your son’s no longer doing business with Puffy?

See, I can’t talk about that. I don’t want my son to get upset—I don’t want to say.

You just know that you don’t want to have anything to do with Puffy.

No. He wasn’t fair to me and my son. Can you talk about Shyne growing up?
Of course.

A lot of people have different images of your son. What was he like when he was growing up?

Shyne was a very smart kid from when he was a baby. When he was six months old he was trying to talk. I knew he was a special kid. He started school when he was two years old.

In Brooklyn or Belize?

In Belize. I don’t want to talk too much about Belize. He was such a special kid. He was always doing excellent in school up here in New York. He went to Manhattan High School, did very well—honors in language arts and English. He was a smart kid.

You say Jamal was a good student, but he definitely got into some trouble…

Peer pressure! I was a very strict mom. Very strict mom—he can tell you.
But he was really sometimes on his own. I go to work in the morning, I come in like at eight o’clock. He’d go to his grandmother, but my mother had to work too. So when Jamal comes home from school, he’s there alone until eight o’clock in the nighttime. [This was] ’til he was 15. It was really, really hard. And he didn’t have the parental guidance. It was like he was on his own
most of the time. It’s not because that’s what I wanted, or that I wasn’t a good parent. I had to go to work to pay the bills. So I didn’t have to go on welfare, because that is not in my system. I don’t want to live on nobody, and I gotta do what I gotta do. So I would go and clean people’s homes. In my country, I was a teacher, a third-grade teacher. But when I came here, I was pre¬pared to do what I had to do to take care of my boy. It still wasn’t all that good. After I paid the bills sometimes food was limited. Very limited. But I had to work and did the best that I
can.

Did you know he was interested in becoming a rapper?

Yes, I knew he was writing poems. But when I came home… I used to work so hard cleaning other people’s houses that by the time I got home, I was so tired. I didn’t even pay those talents any attention. It wasn’t until we moved—after he had gotten shot at 15 years old—that’s when things started changing. We moved to a better neighborhood, and I wanted him to go to college.
He was already signed up to college. And he said to me one day, “Mom, I’m going to put college on hold. ‘Cause I have this vision that I can rap, and I’m going to be a rapper.” And I said, “What are you talking about? You better go to college.” And I walked out of the room. He said, “I’m sorry Mom, but college is going to be on hold.” He was 17. And he said, “I’m signing a contract with Don Pooh Entertainment.” I’m like, “What are you talking about, boy?”
Later on, I did not think any more of the deal. ‘Cause I knew he didn’t have any money to go into a studio. Then one day he said to me, “I’m going to meet Puff Daddy.” But I didn’t pay him any attention, because I didn’t think it was going to be anything. But he had the calling. It was the gift that God sent to him that day. He knew something was going to happen. He was gonna be rich and make a lot of money, ’cause God gave him that vision. He dreamed it.

Are you and your son very religious?

I pray a lot every day. Before I speak on my phone in the morning, before I turn on my TV. I go to church every now and again. It’s not that just because my son’s got problems I go running to the church. I pray every day, because we were born Christian. My grand¬father was a preacher.

I know your son carried a Bible with him during the trial.

He keeps that as his strength. He’s a spiritual person from when he was small and my mother was always talking about the Bible. My mom, his grandmother.

What do you want to happen when your son ets released? Are you worried about him etting right back in the music business? here’s such a demand for him.

All I want is for him to be aware now of the people around him. And to always remember: Never put too much trust in people. And I think he learned that. I can say that my son learned not to be trusting of people. I know he loves his music, and he should focus on his music. That’s a gift, nobody can take that from him. But just be aware.

What do you make of your son’s popularity?

I think my son is bigger than anything right now. And he doesn’t even talk. The thing is, he hasn’t talked to anyone in three years— since your magazine. I think there was a mes¬sage that he wanted to put out there for the young people—to never give up, to never give up hope. Don’t care what, even if your pops is not there for you. Even when your father is not there, you should never give up hope. If you have a dream, just go for it. Never stop. He never stopped. So I think he had a message out there to put out to these kids— especially with his life. He’s telling a true story of what’s out there. And maybe he didn’t live many of it, but he was around it. Living in strength to keep going. Especially his spirit. I always think, Wow—he’s where he’s at, and he has that spirit. You know some people would be so… I commend him, I’m very proud of him. That’s what keeps me going too.

What do you want to say to Shyne’s fans?

I always wanted to say that my son really appreciates them writing him letters, ’cause he has a lot of people that always write him. They keep his music alive. I want to say thanks, especially, to Angie Martinez from Hot 97. Because she kept the flag waving for Jamal from before I even knew her or who she was. She played my son’s songs, and I got to know her a little bit from when my son was being sentenced. I got to meet her, and I really, really wanted to say to her: Thank you. Because she’s always playing his music. I know the other radio stations do too. But she really kept him alive on the air.

How do you react when you hear the rumors that he’s coming out?

You know, it’s a good thing. But it’s bad to spread rumors. Saying stuff like, “He’s coming up to this radio station right now.” People call¬ing me—sometimes I don’t even answer. It’s a good thing, but it’s not good to me. It’s like, when I go out, people approach me: “Oh, when is your son coming home?” Especially the kids, all the kids love him so much. They want to write him. They ask me to give his address. And everywhere I go, people know me. People would tell them, “That’s Shyne’s mama.” But I don’t like that. ‘Cause you don’t know what the people have in the back of their heads.
I just tell everyone, just keep praying. Keep positive. I can’t give them no time [when Shyne will be released]. God is the one to make all the decisions. He’s the one that knows everything.